The safe waiting for me

[bernie]

I've been asked if I can open this safe, answer no (at the moment) I don't/didn't have a clue how to. That got me thinking 'why not', so off to google and start the search. I found a few " how to's " hmm that's not enough, found a book on Amazon (Daggers), then I ended here "awesome".
I've got a S&G 6741 on it's way to try out what I've been reading. I think I maybe hooked already lol.

This is the safe, they want to remove it but it's bolted down, no combo for it, the previous owner of the building never used it. So that is my challenge, not getting paid for it and no real time limit to get it open. Just for the fun of it.

mysafe.png

I have had a play with it, the dail has a lot of play in it, the contact points are easy to feel and hear LCP 14 RCP 5, 3 wheels. No idea what lock it is, no name, S&G - LG -?
I've tried to find pictures of the same Dial and Ring, no luck with that.

So if anyone has an idea on make model of the lock, that would be good. For now I'm just going to learn from the S&G when it gets here. That safe is going nowhere for the moment.

[Doogs]

Welcome to Keypicking Bernie.

It looks like you have a challenge on your hands and I wish you luck with your spinning on that challenge you have found for yourself. I will be looking forward to reading about your progress. Be sure to post your charts and all the the gruesome details as your manipulation proceeds so we can live vicariously through your experience.

[Altashot]

Looks like S and G dial and ring.
Wish you success.

M.

[Oldfast]

I agree. Looks like an S&G dial and ring.

Good you have one on the way. Should help you tremendously
to spend some time with that one before you tackle that safe.

Looking forward to following along

[bernie]

I don't think there will be a lot of spinning going on, more like slow turning and questioning myself every step of the way. I'm used to building up a picture of a lock in my mind from picking lever lock but this is going to be different, I'll be getting totally lost in the wheels but hopefully come out the other side with a good result.
I need to get my head around the charting, remembering that left is actually right and right is left lol
Can't wait to get this going, already printed out loads of graph/chart paper as I couldn't get excel to look right with dummy data, so pencil and paper it is for now.

Watch this space for all the ups and downs, there could even be tears lol

Cheers

[Altashot]

If you are already used to visualizing, then it's shouldn't be too difficult for you to visualize a combination lock either.
I visualize myself in almost every lock I pick or manipulate. It has help me understand how everything works and even successfully diagnose
problems with various locks or safes.

I picture myself inside the lock, as if I was a miniature me, the size of an insect. That way I can "look around" and "see" what is happening.
I psyche myself saying: I am the key, or the pick, or drive cam or whatever else I need to be, all with my eyes closed at first, then I mentally
hold onto the picture or scenario I created. Once the picture is clearly formed in my mind, I can "see" with my hands.

People that have a strong sense of spacial visualization, from my experience, have a slight advantage than those that don't have it or those that have not developed it enough.
I am not a teacher, but I have explained my technique to many apprentices and, many have thanked me for changing the way they approach different tasks as they became more successful at it.
Those that didn't believe me or thought that it was foolish to picture yourself as an insect or mini you or whatever, either gave up or seemingly delayed their
skills from developing further and are, in my opinion, hindering their learning curve.

When working with a combination lock, I don't even have to count my turns anymore or even look at my hand to know how many turns
I have completed, the image in my mind is so clear that I can "see" the wheels pick up, I always know where the gate is on the cam and which wheel(s) I am moving.
Fortunately for me, this sense has always been strong even when I was a little kid, but anyone can do it. like anything else, with practice, one gets better at it.

What you have is a gift, walk in there with confidence and spin that dial. even if you are only "spinning your wheels" (pun intended) at first, visualize and pay close attention
to what your hand is feeling. Try to feel when a wheel is picked up and visualize it moving, try to keep that wheel moving while respecting it's relation with the drive cam.
Visualization has helped me allot and I was rewarded with success. I hope others will too.

Now, I can visualize almost anything...Except where the gates are.

I don't like to wish people good luck as it implies that success would be based on mere luck.
Instead I wish people success, as this is a direct result of what you were trying to do in the first place...Open that b*tch!

Keep us posted.

M.

[magician59]

Looks like a pretty significant cash safe.
http://www.bdblockandsafe.co.uk/recondi ... -1812.aspx

[bernie]

Looks like a pretty significant cash safe.
"http://www.bdblockandsafe.co.uk/reconditioned-safes/smp-mercian-1812.aspx"

Looking at the way you guys spin those dials it's not that good, as it only has 3 wheels, it's an old one. If I can't do it then he'll just have to get someone in who can or just make a feature of it lol

[VancouverSpecial]

If you are already used to visualizing, then it's shouldn't be too difficult for you to visualize a combination lock either.
I visualize myself in almost every lock I pick or manipulate. It has help me understand how everything works and even successfully diagnose
problems with various locks or safes.

I picture myself inside the lock, as if I was a miniature me, the size of an insect. That way I can "look around" and "see" what is happening.
I psyche myself saying: I am the key, or the pick, or drive cam or whatever else I need to be, all with my eyes closed at first, then I mentally
hold onto the picture or scenario I created. Once the picture is clearly formed in my mind, I can "see" with my hands.

People that have a strong sense of spacial visualization, from my experience, have a slight advantage than those that don't have it or those that have not developed it enough.
I am not a teacher, but I have explained my technique to many apprentices and, many have thanked me for changing the way they approach different tasks as they became more successful at it.
Those that didn't believe me or thought that it was foolish to picture yourself as an insect or mini you or whatever, either gave up or seemingly delayed their
skills from developing further and are, in my opinion, hindering their learning curve.

When working with a combination lock, I don't even have to count my turns anymore or even look at my hand to know how many turns
I have completed, the image in my mind is so clear that I can "see" the wheels pick up, I always know where the gate is on the cam and which wheel(s) I am moving.
Fortunately for me, this sense has always been strong even when I was a little kid, but anyone can do it. like anything else, with practice, one gets better at it.

What you have is a gift, walk in there with confidence and spin that dial. even if you are only "spinning your wheels" (pun intended) at first, visualize and pay close attention
to what your hand is feeling. Try to feel when a wheel is picked up and visualize it moving, try to keep that wheel moving while respecting it's relation with the drive cam.
Visualization has helped me allot and I was rewarded with success. I hope others will too.

Now, I can visualize almost anything...Except where the gates are.

I don't like to wish people good luck as it implies that success would be based on mere luck.
Instead I wish people success, as this is a direct result of what you were trying to do in the first place...Open that b*tch!

Keep us posted.

M.

Wow, thank-you for your advice - amazing!
I'm printing this out so I can remember to read it over a couple more times this week so it really sinks in.

As per the sensei - bernie, I wish you success!
Sean

[bernie]

It's been a long week waiting for this to arrive from the US, well worth the wait though
Here she is, as good as new. I just need to mount it on a nice piece of wood, mind you it may end up on some plywood at first because I can't wait to start.
It has a short shaft because it has come from a gun safe

S&G6741p.jpg

S&G6741d.jpg

S&G6741b.jpg

Let the lessons begin lol

Cheers

[jharveee]

Yeah!
Glad you got your lock.
Take your time and mount with care. This will save you a lot of frustration.
When I mounted mine I had trouble getting it just right. It was to tight or to loose, depending where I installed the spline key.
Ended up (after a lot of spinning my wheels) Shimming behind the body of the lock to get it just right.

[Oldfast]

Very excited for you!

.....mind you it may end up on some plywood at first because I can't wait to start.

I hear ya! But as jharveee mentioned... take time now & have less frustration later.
This video was helpful when I attempt my first one... http://youtu.be/mjmLG8tNfWQ

There's also a number of threads around here on mounting locks
that I would call Q&A, problems, trouble-shooting, and solutions.
Good news is that the Safe section here is not enormous, so you
might not have to search through too much to find them.

[bernie]

I have mounted the lock (plywood) it all works ok, lots of spinning to get the feel for it. I've had a go at charting/mapping the wheels with the known combination, just to get my head around it. I noticed in my first post on here ^^^ I got my RCP mixed up with LCP, they are the wrong way round, so I have learned something lol.

I changed the combination and mapped the wheels again, W3 is easy to find, park that on it's number then I run the other 2 wheels together, that's when it starts to go wrong, I keep forgetting to park W3 before checking the contact area. Just playing around with it, lots more spinning needed with the back off to get used to the way the wheels work.

It drives you crazy but it's all good fun

Cheers

[Altashot]

it's a great way to learn when you can take the back off, at least you can see what's happening before you get all confused...

I was reading in a book the other day, The Future of the Mind, by Michio Kaku, that there is a rule; The 10000 hour rule.
Basically, it states that to be a professional at anything, one must practice for at least 10000 hours.
This creates new paths in the brain that allows the information to travel faster and more effectively.
Soooo...It doesn't happen overnight.

Keep at it Bernie, patience is the key.
Visualize...You'll get it.

M.

[Oldfast]

I was wondering how it was going. Great to hear ya got it mounted with no problems!