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Sweet

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anomie

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Location: Austin, TX

Post Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:02 pm

Sweet

Ran over to a local locksmith shop just now - said I was getting into hobby picking and wanted a lock that I could dump the pin stacks out of the bible without having to get the lock open. I was sort of worried that I might not get a lot of help telling them that I wanted to learn to pick but telling them straight up seemed better than trying to ask for what I wanted without mentioning picking, given that they'd probably know what I wanted it for anyway.

So the owner rummaged around some bins and found me a little lock that has the removable metal plate/clip/whatever it is on the top. Talked about picking a bit, he warned me it's probably a bad idea to have any picks on me in public without a locksmith license (I already sort of figured that, I looked up the law here in Texas and it's a 'show intent' type of deal, but cops might decide you need a ride anyway - not that I've ever had any trouble with the law).

He was really helpful overall, and I figure I've found a spot I can get whatever I want to get as I do this (parts, locks, whatever) - and it's /close/ (about a mile away). I saw a used master 911 hanging up on the wall (with keys, but the plastic shell cracked a little bit), and I figured, what the hell, I'll buy that too, I'll get to it eventually, and I kind of wanted to show this guy that I appreciate the help a bit more than the few bucks he sold me the lock out of the bin for.
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mech

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Post Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:25 pm

Re: Sweet

nice man, you will be suprised how far a good deed will take you in situations like that.
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anomie

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Post Mon Jun 18, 2012 2:45 pm

Re: Sweet

I popped the little cap off the bible and dumped out the guts and put it back together. It's kind of gummed up, is using some hoppes #9 an a little gun oil a terrible idea for cleaning it up/lubricating it? I know I've read some threads saying don't use wet lubricants for locks you're going to use because it will gum it up over time as the oil or whatever collects dust/etc but I figure since I'm not going to use it for anything but practice it's probably OK.
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LocksmithArmy

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Post Mon Jun 18, 2012 2:51 pm

Re: Sweet

liquid lubracants are bad if ur gonna install the lock... but if ur gonna constantly take it apart and fiddle with it it wont be an issue...

ideally you would use the oil to clean it... then wash all the oil off before assembly...
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Pokey wrote:"Come and get me, loser! Spankity spankity spankity!"
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anomie

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Post Mon Jun 18, 2012 4:06 pm

Re: Sweet

Thanks!

There's a thread here somewhere about a lock that construction sites use where the construction company has a master used during the build, and then the owner key will lock out the master on first use by dropping some balls out of the pin stacks into holes or slots in the core. I am pretty sure this core is like that because when I pulled it out there's a parallel line of smaller-diameter holes next to the pin holes, although it didn't have any balls in them. I pulled it out and thought "what the ..." then "oh, yeah, it must be that construction master thing ...". Thought it was pretty cool.
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anomie

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Post Tue Jun 26, 2012 8:08 pm

In just seven days, I can unlock your hasp

My picks came in one week ago today. In the meantime, I'd picked every lock and cylinder I own (and wasn't using) - except for that Master 911 I bought on a whim at the locksmith, noted in the start of this thread. Until today.

911pickedandcropped.JPG


Seven days from never having a lock picked in my life to picking open one that I've read uses spools (and this one certainly does, or at least it feels a whole lot like people say picking spools does). That made me happy.
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edsmiley

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Contributor - Research & Development Kingpin
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Post Wed Jun 27, 2012 5:44 pm

Re: Sweet

Nice Anomie! Nice job on the lock and great attitude towards picking.

Yeah, I have heard differing reports of what locksmiths think about picking. Sounds like you have a good one there, so stick with them!

Ed
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer

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Post Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:51 pm

Re: Sweet

Nice job!! I was surprised to find all spools in the first 911 I gutted.

viewtopic.php?p=41965#p41965

Is yours the same I wonder?

Keep up the good work... and keep sharing it :)
" Enjoy the journey AS MUCH as the destination."
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anomie

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Post Fri Jun 29, 2012 11:44 pm

Re: Sweet

Oldfast wrote:Is yours the same I wonder?


It feels like it. As far as I can tell, as soon as I put any tension on it, all the pins get not-springy, and they all push back through the tension wrench - although I don't get a visible (to me) false set until I've set most of the pins. It's possible that I'm missing something.
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer

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Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:16 am

Location: Michigan

Post Sat Jun 30, 2012 4:41 pm

Re: Sweet

Nope, you're not missing anything. Sounds like all spools to me. Yours reacts exactly like mine. Nice job
" Enjoy the journey AS MUCH as the destination."
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.45cal

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Post Sun Jul 01, 2012 10:41 am

Re: Sweet

Good job! next thing you have to do is gut it, post the pic and bask in the awesomeness of having kicked this locks butt spool ins and all!
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anomie

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Post Sun Jul 01, 2012 8:16 pm

Re: Sweet

Definitely will do that :) Thanks for all the encouragement.

Last week I bought 10 arrow cylinders on ebay, all keyed differently. After seeing the $120 set of progressively pinned cylinders at toool.us, I decided I'd use my 10 cylinders (which I bought for *way* less than that shipped) to make myself some training cylinders.

Ten cylinders, all keyed differently - and the key bitting was on the keys. So I typed all the key bittings into a text file and wrote myself some code to count what pins I had available, so I could figure out what to do with them. I decided I'd skip making one pin cylinders, which leaves me with, what do I make? So I added on to the code until it could tell me which pairs of keys I could make two sets of progressively pinned cylinders, each set of five using a different key - and it turned out there were various keys I could use. I chose the two keys that left me with the most extra pins of the pins sizes I was using, just in case.

  Code:
(defvar *keycode-list* nil)
(defvar *available-pins* (make-array 10 :initial-element 0))

(defmacro read-iterate ((varname data-filename) &rest code)
  "read-iterate varname data-filename &rest code - loop through the forms in
   a file and execute a peice of code. The expanded code will use varname
   to hold each form read"
  `(with-open-file (data-file ,data-filename :direction :input)
     (when data-file
       (do ((,varname (read-line data-file nil) (read-line data-file nil)))
           ((null ,varname) T)
         ,@code))))

(defun make-ratchet-predicate (n)
  "make-ratched-predicate returns a predicate that returns true after it
   has been called (abs n) times"
  (let ((count (abs n)))
    (lambda ()
      (or (= 0 count) (not (setf count (1- count)))))))

(defun make-pin-counter (n &optional (minpins 1))
  "make-pin-counter returns a function that will return the correct number
   of pins needed to make a progressive set of cylinders with each successive
   call, assuming that n is the number of pins in the final cylinder and
   minpins is the minimum number of pins in the first cylinder"
  (let ((predicate (make-ratchet-predicate minpins))
        (pincount (- n (1- minpins))))
    (lambda ()
      (if (funcall predicate)
          (setf pincount (1- pincount))
          pincount))))
     
(defun code-to-list (keycode)
  "Converts a keycode to a list of integers"
  (map 'list #'digit-char-p keycode))

(defun add-all-bittings (keycode &optional (pincounts *available-pins*))
  "Adds all bittings from a keycode to an array of available pins"
  (map 'nil #'(lambda (pin)
                (setf (aref pincounts pin) (1+ (aref pincounts pin))))
       (code-to-list keycode)))

(defun leftover-pins (available-pins required-pins)
  "Return the pins left over after using required-pins from the stock
   of available-pins"
  (map 'vector #'- available-pins required-pins))

(defun required-pins (keycode &optional (minpins 1))
  "Return the pins required to progressively pin a particular keycode
   assuming a minimum of minpins pins used in the first cylinder"
  (let ((result (make-array 10 :initial-element 0))
        (counter (make-pin-counter (length keycode) minpins)))
    (map 'nil #'(lambda (pin)
                  (setf (aref result pin) (+ (aref result pin)
                                             (funcall counter))))
         (code-to-list keycode))
    result))

(defun progressive-pins-p (keycode available &optional (minpins 1))
  "Return T if it is possible to progressively pin the keycode using
   available pins"
  (let* ((required (required-pins keycode minpins))
         (leftover (leftover-pins available required)))
    (values
     (not (find-if #'(lambda (value) (< value 0)) leftover))
     required
     leftover)))

(defun clear-pin-data ()
  "Reset special pin data variable"
  (setf *available-pins* (make-array 10 :initial-element 0)))

(defun clear-key-data ()
  "Reset special key list variable"
  (setf *keycode-list* nil))

(defun load-all-data ()
  "Load pin data from data file into special pin data variable"
  (clear-key-data)
  (clear-pin-data)
  (read-iterate (keycode "keyinfo.dat")
    (push keycode *keycode-list*)
    (add-all-bittings keycode))
  (setf *keycode-list* (nreverse *keycode-list*)))

(defun keycode-list ()
  "Return a list of all key codes from the data file"
  *keycode-list*)

(defun progressive-pin-info ()
  "reset and load all data, then print out which pairs of keys can be
   progressively pinned into 5 cylinders using the available pins"
  (labels ((rec-progressive-pin (list available)
             (when list
               (let ((keycode (first list)))
                 (multiple-value-bind (possible required leftover)
                     (progressive-pins-p keycode available 2)
                   (when possible
                     (dolist (secondcode (rest list))
                       (multiple-value-bind (possible required leftover)
                           (progressive-pins-p secondcode leftover 2)
                         (when possible
                           (format t "Can pin ~A and ~A : ~A~%"
                                   keycode secondcode leftover)))))))
               (rec-progressive-pin (rest list) available))))
    (load-all-data)
    (rec-progressive-pin (keycode-list) *available-pins*)))


At this point I took the two cylinders using the keys I wanted (bitted 513432 and 326561 respectively), and set them aside. Since they're already keyed for the keys I want to use, they will be the six-pin cylinders for the sets. I cut off a piece of 1/2" wooden dowel. This morning, I took a hobby knife and hollowed out one end of the dowel (so it would fit over the end of the plug, which had some clips, etc for the tailpiece), took a cylinder, dumped it, and used that cylinder to make sure the dowel would fit through, and that the end I'd hollowed out was the right size, etc. It was a very tight fit to start so I just sanded it a little until it would move through easily but not too easily.

So now I have a homegrown plug follower:
plugfollowed.jpg


I started dumping the cylinders, and used a playmat to keep track of what pins were what:
trackingpins.jpg


Keyed four cylinders, starting with five pins, with the last cylinder getting the front two pins, to one key - then did the same with four cylinders for the other key, leaving me with two five-cylinder progressively pinned training sets (and extra driver pins, key pins, and springs, not shown):
afterwithfollower.jpg


I then promptly picked them (although this took me a bit when it got to 5 and 6 pins - I have, a couple of times, known exactly what the lock state was, telling myself 'set this pin and it opens' and been right, but I am not very good at it yet and it doesn't happen that often, which is part of the reason I'm making myself progressively pinned training sets):
allpicked.jpg


Thanks to everyone in the chat who helped me out as I was figuring out what I was going to do and how to do it. It helped immensely. I figure I'll pick them all over and over, kind of like a guitarist doing scales, until such a time as I feel like I've progressed enough - at which point I'll take one of them and put in security pins.
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