These springy pins...

[lmmjgt]

So I have a Master no.140 lock, and I recently learned how to deal with spools. The only thing is that sometimes I feel the first binding pin, and everything's fine and dandy, lock's easy to pick. But other times I feel that all pins are springy and none of them seem to be binding, I use a medium tension for this lock but I've tried with variations to see if it is indeed tension the problem, with no result; I also make sure that all pins are in their resting position beforehand. Funny enough, I leave the lock for a while and when I return I feel the pins binding. Am I overlooking some tension problem or is it the spool that's giving me a hard time?

Thanks.

[Papa Gleb]

If its an old lock or been outside long enough there could be dirt and gunk in the chambers so although you reset all the pins, not all could be falling down. Dry some lube.

[mercurial]

If its an old lock or been outside long enough there could be dirt and gunk in the chambers so although you reset all the pins, not all could be falling down. Dry some lube.

Lubricating the lock is a good idea if it could have debris inside, but debris isn't the problem here. If all pins are springy , then no drivers are stuck up in the bible. Even if a driver or two is stuck, whilst those pin stacks won't bind, the pin stacks keeping the plug from turning will still bind.

OP : are you tensioning the lock from the bottom of the keyway? If you are, it's possible to bind the tension wrench against the body of the lock & when that happens as you apply force, you aren't tensioning the plug, instead you are pushing the blade of the tension tool into the housing at the bottom of the keyway.

This problem gets worse if your tension tool isn't nice and smooth - sharp edges dig in more easily. Sharp edges can also result in a notch developing in the housing where the tool is biting in & this makes the problem worse, it becomes a vicious circle.

Try top of keyway tension & the problem should disappear.

...Mark

[lmmjgt]

It's possible to bind the tension wrench against the body of the lock & when that happens as you apply force, you aren't tensioning the plug, instead you are pushing the blade of the tension tool into the housing at the bottom of the keyway.

Yes, that's it! I can't pick it using TOK, because of the pick I'm using, but there's a slight rotation from the bottom that tells me when it isn't pressing against the housing, so I know that there are pins binding. The problem also seems to arise from the fact that I'm using a very narrow tension wrench for this keyway, it fits but it's easy to get it stuck into the housing.

Thanks!

[Neilau]

As PapaGleb suggests try a bit of lubrication.

Even on new locks a bit of lubrication will often help.

There is a thread some ware here on lubricants.

I use 3-in 1 professional Lock lubricant made by the WD-40 company but there are many others.

[g_kinz]

lol i was just digging around in a box of pad locks i had and found a 140. never knew it was as tough as it was. saw master and never even tried it lol

[Oldfast]

I too find that some of them can actually be rather tricky!

Some gut-shots of a 140 here... just in case it helps.

[Deadlock]

Thanks for that Oldfast.

The 140 is one irritating little b@stard of a lock. Or, alternatively, a hidden gem, with much higher security than you would expect.

Edited to add: lmmjgt, if you learned how to handle spools from this lock, kudos to you. I get next to no feedback from it.

[lmmjgt]

Well, to be frank Deadlock I'm still on the process of knowing how to pick those spools, I just memorised the binding orders after a while but still cannot make a sense of why it works that way. I'm trying with different 140's, but since you mentioned that you can't get feedback from those, guess it'll be better to practise with a different spooled padlock, don't wanna be learning it wrong.

Cheers.

[Neilau]

Try this.

Take a small half diamond and jiggle it up and down in the lock while moving it in and out of the lock, while applying LIGHT tension.

At some point (fairly quickly) the cylinder will turn about 10 degrees.

While still keeping tension on the cylinder, change to a short hook and feel each pin.

The pins that do not budge have been set, the pins that tend to push back on the torsion tool are the spools that have not yet set.

Still keeping light tension on the tool lift these spools. It may be only one or two pins that have to be set.

The trick is to jiggle the half diamond around (using light tension) till the cylinder turns 10 degrees. When that happens you are almost there.

Once you have opened it, close it and do it again and again till you get the feel for spools.

Good luck.

[Deadlock]

Have to say, I don't get any noticeable false set with the 140 I've got. The first two pins set fairly easily, but I have to do that by listening for the clicks, rather than feel. I can feel something happening with the plug when I set the first pin, but I can't see any movement in the keyway.

lmmjgt, instead of a padlock, try a Yale 5 pin rim cylinder. It will (or should) have two spools, which are 'traditionally' on 2 and 4, although the first one I ever got had them on 2 and 3. These are much nicer to pick than a Master 140. It took me a looong time to pick the first one. I was actually getting counter-rotation, but I thought I was causing it by levering the pick against the tension wrench. It took months before I understood what was actually happening, and just how far back the plug had to rotate out of the false set. Slow learner!