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how do you guys pick Meddecos any advice

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UN-locked1

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Location: England

Post Thu Dec 31, 2015 6:15 pm

how do you guys pick Meddecos any advice

Hi guys as me being from England we don't come across many meddecos which are wonderfully locks tonight I got my classic picked with a combination of s.pp and light rakeing I just wanted some advice how to get these picked I have a payphone one as well I have READ XEOS WONDERFULL WRITE UP I WOULD LIKE TO NO YOU GUYS learning EXPERIENCE with these and how to avoid mistakes better method technique .

Thank you HAPPY NEW YEAR GUYS
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xeo

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Post Thu Dec 31, 2015 6:18 pm

Re: how do you guys pick Meddecos any advice

O_O
Image
The code is hidden in the tumblers. One position opens the lock, another position opens one of these doors...
http://www.youtube.com/xeotech1

(ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡┻━┻

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MBI

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Post Thu Dec 31, 2015 7:31 pm

Re: how do you guys pick Meddecos any advice

Nice job!

To pick Medecos I made a tension wrench to fit those insanely wide keyways, then I dumped all the pin stacks but one. I learned to lift and rotate the pins with a hook pick, and how to tell the difference in the feedback when the sidebar is set in the false groove of a pin and in the correct groove.

Once I had a feel for the false groove and learned to have good control of rotating the pin, I added another pin stack, learned to pick it that way, and continued adding pin stacks up until I could pick them with all six pin stacks. I found a pretty big jump in difficulty between five pin stacks and six pin stacks. Not totally sure why, although I have some vague ideas about it.

The original Medecos gave me the most difficulty since the keyways are narrower and the pin tips have a different shape so they are a bit harder to turn with a hook pick. Biaxial and m3 are very similar to pick except with the m3 you just have to reach in and poke the slider with the tip of the pick when you think you have it picked. If everything is set correctly it'll open when you poke the slider. If it doesn't open, you have to go back over the pins and check again if any are set in the false groove or hung up on a spool or something. Just keep poking the slider every time you think you might have everything set. Doesn't take much effort so don't push hard, if it's correctly picked the slider will drop right into place and the plug will turn.

For checking the pin rotation to see if it's in the false groove or the correct groove, I found it can be a bit helpful to file a small groove in the tip of the hook. You can cup the tip of the pick to one side or the other and wiggle it (rotationally). If it's set correctly it'll have a tiny bit of play in it. If the rotation is bound up tight it's probably in the false groove. Or else you're not wiggling it properly to be able to tell if it has some play in it.

One final thing I try when I'm pretty sure I have the shearline set correctly and I HAD thought the rotations were correct but it still won't open, I take a Falle curve and stick it all the way back in the keyway. I'll use very light tension with the tension wrench, tilt the Falle curve left or right, and gently rake it over the tips of the pins as I withdraw it from the keyway. I'll do that several times, alternating between tilting the curve right or left to try to dislodge a falsely set rotation into the correct sidebar groove. Occasionally that'll work and it'll open. If it doesn't, I drop the pins and start over.

It's been years now so I can't remember exactly how long it took, but I kept an m3 in my pocket while I was learning to pick it. I worked on it for a few minutes here and there in my spare time, might have taken me around two weeks to learn to pick them, but I can't remember for sure. I didn't really keep track exactly. Learning it progressively like that sure made it a lot easier for me.
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davesnothere11

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Post Thu Dec 31, 2015 9:10 pm

Re: how do you guys pick Meddecos any advice

MBI wrote:Nice job!

To pick Medecos I made a tension wrench to fit those insanely wide keyways, then I dumped all the pin stacks but one. I learned to lift and rotate the pins with a hook pick, and how to tell the difference in the feedback when the sidebar is set in the false groove of a pin and in the correct groove.

Once I had a feel for the false groove and learned to have good control of rotating the pin, I added another pin stack, learned to pick it that way, and continued adding pin stacks up until I could pick them with all six pin stacks. I found a pretty big jump in difficulty between five pin stacks and six pin stacks. Not totally sure why, although I have some vague ideas about it.

The original Medecos gave me the most difficulty since the keyways are narrower and the pin tips have a different shape so they are a bit harder to turn with a hook pick. Biaxial and m3 are very similar to pick except with the m3 you just have to reach in and poke the slider with the tip of the pick when you think you have it picked. If everything is set correctly it'll open when you poke the slider. If it doesn't open, you have to go back over the pins and check again if any are set in the false groove or hung up on a spool or something. Just keep poking the slider every time you think you might have everything set. Doesn't take much effort so don't push hard, if it's correctly picked the slider will drop right into place and the plug will turn.

For checking the pin rotation to see if it's in the false groove or the correct groove, I found it can be a bit helpful to file a small groove in the tip of the hook. You can cup the tip of the pick to one side or the other and wiggle it (rotationally). If it's set correctly it'll have a tiny bit of play in it. If the rotation is bound up tight it's probably in the false groove. Or else you're not wiggling it properly to be able to tell if it has some play in it.

One final thing I try when I'm pretty sure I have the shearline set correctly and I HAD thought the rotations were correct but it still won't open, I take a Falle curve and stick it all the way back in the keyway. I'll use very light tension with the tension wrench, tilt the Falle curve left or right, and gently rake it over the tips of the pins as I withdraw it from the keyway. I'll do that several times, alternating between tilting the curve right or left to try to dislodge a falsely set rotation into the correct sidebar groove. Occasionally that'll work and it'll open. If it doesn't, I drop the pins and start over.

It's been years now so I can't remember exactly how long it took, but I kept an m3 in my pocket while I was learning to pick it. I worked on it for a few minutes here and there in my spare time, might have taken me around two weeks to learn to pick them, but I can't remember for sure. I didn't really keep track exactly. Learning it progressively like that sure made it a lot easier for me.


Nice additional info MBI. I've been contemplating making or finding a maker of a .015" Hook similar to your description.

I've been messing around with some Medecos too. Xeo's write up is great! So far I 've found the payphone locks give a good audible and tactile "chunk" when you are setting the side bar first compared to my mortise biaxials.
(18:56:54) HAL 9000 Sez: It isn't so much bait as it is chum

My lock photography: https://flic.kr/s/aHskv3U6Tx
My picking videos:https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCr_YDBWHU0VpoIjmfocIbuw
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MBI

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Post Thu Dec 31, 2015 9:25 pm

Re: how do you guys pick Meddecos any advice

davesnothere11 wrote:Nice additional info MBI. I've been contemplating making or finding a maker of a .015" Hook similar to your description.


Not terribly hard to make yourself. All you need is a needle file and 30 seconds to carefully file the groove where you need it.
If you like to sand your picks so they give better feedback (I highly recommend it) then I'd wait to file the groove AFTER you sand and polish the picks. That way the groove has crisp edges so it grabs the pin tips more securely.

You don't really need the groove in the tip of the pick for picking Medecos or setting the pin rotations, but I found it to be somewhat helpful to me when wiggling the pins after I set them, to see if they're set correctly in the real groove instead of the false groove.
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Neilau

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Post Thu Dec 31, 2015 9:34 pm

Re: how do you guys pick Meddecos any advice

Everything MBI said.

I’ll humbly add to it from my experience with opening them.

I dumped all the pins and started with two pins at the back (pin 1 and 2). As you add pins, mix them up. I didn’t do this till I could do 5 pins and just ended up knowing one particular lock very well. Mixing up the pins all the time will help you get a feel quicker.

Each additional pin added makes the lock orders of magnitude more difficult. It took me almost as long to get 6 pins as it took to build up to five.

One other thing I found useful was this little hook for rotating the pins. Made from a piece of unwound guitar D string (medium gauge seems to be the best). You can feel the grove in the pin and use it to rotate the pin. It will fit up beside the pick.

med hook.jpg



Anyway, like MBI said, it will take a while and a lot of practice.

The nice thing about the Medecos is that you can mix up the pins and in effect have a lot of different lock to practice on.

Oh, one last thing. Because of the chisel shape of the pins be careful using the hook as you can easily mash up the edge of the pins.

Good luck.
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Shifty1

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Location: Ontario Canada

Post Fri Jan 01, 2016 12:16 am

Re: how do you guys pick Meddecos any advice

I've recently acquired some Medeco Biaxial cylinders and I've been having a go at them. Progressive pinning is the only way to get experience with these locks. One must also have a lot of intrest in locksport and put in a lot of practice on these babys. Oh yeah, I should also mention... more practice! :wavebye:
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davesnothere11

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Joined: Tue Jul 21, 2015 8:41 pm

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Post Fri Jan 01, 2016 1:21 am

Re: how do you guys pick Meddecos any advice

MBI wrote:
davesnothere11 wrote:Nice additional info MBI. I've been contemplating making or finding a maker of a .015" Hook similar to your description.


Not terribly hard to make yourself. All you need is a needle file and 30 seconds to carefully file the groove where you need it.
If you like to sand your picks so they give better feedback (I highly recommend it) then I'd wait to file the groove AFTER you sand and polish the picks. That way the groove has crisp edges so it grabs the pin tips more securely.

You don't really need the groove in the tip of the pick for picking Medecos or setting the pin rotations, but I found it to be somewhat helpful to me when wiggling the pins after I set them, to see if they're set correctly in the real groove instead of the false groove.


I've had decent success rotating pins with a Peterson gem due to the point of the pick. I have beeter success in settling pins with a standard hook though, except for some of the more radical Medeco bittings. That's what led me to believe a pick similar to Peterson's standard hook but a hair deeper and with a V cut to rotate pins would be ideal.

MBI do you have a picture of your modified pick?
(18:56:54) HAL 9000 Sez: It isn't so much bait as it is chum

My lock photography: https://flic.kr/s/aHskv3U6Tx
My picking videos:https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCr_YDBWHU0VpoIjmfocIbuw
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Scrince

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Post Fri Jan 01, 2016 1:45 am

Re: how do you guys pick Meddecos any advice

Special tool called Medecoder !!!
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A spy is just a criminal with a government paycheck.....
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UN-locked1

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Post Fri Jan 01, 2016 6:47 pm

Re: how do you guys pick Meddecos any advice

Thank you very much guys so far I've found s.p.p. then finish of raking and I've had plenty of opens tonight I don't no way I would have done without you guys

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