Supra key safes

[Visitor]

Anyone any tips on the supra key Safes?
Got 20 to open towards the end of the week and would prefer not to just grind them off.

I've got ahold of one to play with but haven't worked out any manipulation tricks with it yet, im going to see if slipping it works later when it's a but quieter but I suspect it won't.
Incidentally the one I've got doesn't have a combo either but I am going to poke in the rear mounting holes, remove the plastic card and scope the combo that way to open it.
Any help appreciated.

Incidentally I know the mk1 had a fault that allowed a decode but this and the others are newer than that.

[10ringo10]

The key safe vulnerability was fixed in 2015 for the C and P500
It was a easy bypass also when they fitted them to key cabinets the vulnerability was to simply remove the doors
Hinge pin ... Maybe that's the way to go if they where manufactured after 2015
Investigate how the hinge pins held in place and can it without too much
Trouble be replaced if sacrificed or simply cut at the 2 points needed must have a grub screw or pin!
How much pressure or sideways force is required to pop that retaining Hinge pin ..alot of pressure can be put on using a modified C- clamp bolt
The mk 1 did not have a hinge so not looked into ..possible vulnerability in the mk 2 Waiting to be discovered
Scoping if not fixed via the holes in back for the change screws is problematic as the card is in the way so needs to be pulled to one side prior but a plausible attack on the C 500 the P 500 I've seen have a metal plate upgrade not a card .

Good luck on 20 of these

[Visitor]

Thanks for your reply, attacking the hinge pin is a method I was considering but I need to open this one to remind myself what the internal lip and catch look like, it could be possible once the hinge pin is removed the door may still not open.
The main problems with hinge pin removal is if they are mounted next to each other which may mean once one is open it will have to be removed from the wall in order to attack the next one also its probable the pin won't go back in as secure and render the box pointless.
From looking at the test piece I have here I think it's probably shrunk in with a cold pin and hot box.

The idea of scoping was only for the one I have here, its not mounted and does just have the plastic card so it was only a way for me to get this one open to play with the mechanics of it, at the moment I can only play with the outside as it's locked with lost combo and I could do with seeing how various attacks affects the mechanism from the inside.

I will check to see if there's a grub screw or somthing for the hinge pin on the inside once it's open, thanks for your thoughts on this.
For speed and effort I suspect its easier to pry them off the wall rather than attacking the pin but I'll certainly look into it.

The job is to open and reset the combos so they can be used, the locks any keys would have operated have already been changed.

[femurat]

I wonder if it's possible to decode the lock like a direct entry safe lock.
I'd hot-glue a laser pointer to the knob, attach a rubber band to turn it open, reset the lock, mark where the point is. Press one number and check if it changes the point position. Reset the lock and repeat.

Good luck

[Visitor]

Its funny you say that, I didn't have chance to do anything with it yesterday but the day before I was doing just that and gauging where the open lever was in relation to the top of the silver back plate and I was sure on some numbers it was closer by a small fraction.
I've got yo do the job tomorrow so ideally need to come up with somthing today between call outs.
The laser idea is a very good shout, I'll need to open the one I have and mount it, knowing the current combo will allow me to look for differences.

I'll report back.

[10ringo10]

[quote="reset the lock, mark where the point is. Press one number and check if it changes the point position. Reset the lock and repeat.

Yes that's how the vulnerability actually worked in the supra lock pre 2015
A very noticeable movement occurred on the turn knob when the correct number was pressed inward or depressed
If this is occurring ...this is the way forward
Thanks fem for pointing this out I'd completely jumped the gun thinking this had already been carried out and no signs of this had been seen .

[Visitor]

Well the old vuralblity definitely doesn't work on the newer locks and I had already tried it (I should have been cleaer on my first post) but with a laser I did wonder if a slight change was still evident but it wasn't.

To cut a long story short I turned up to the job yesterday, which was a bank holiday in the UK by the way, and found all the boxes gone with a few crowbar marks here and there on the brickwork so I presume the builder had a go himself.

Luckily I charge a call out instead of labour charges others do so as I wasn't cancelled and still attended I've sent them my invoice which of course was a bank holiday rate.

[10ringo10]

Sounds like they hired another magician to make them disappear because sometimes they think we can just turn up and sprinkle magic dust to open and fix locks hope you charged double for bank holiday

[Visitor]

I don't charge double but just my normal out of hours rate which they were aware of. It was one of those 'got to be done on friday' jobs regardless of bank holiday or not.
Problem is they've left marks on the brick work and its got 80 holes with rawlplugs hanging out of most of them, im guessing someone somewhere is going to question that but it's not my concern as long as they don't think it was me. Luckily I've got a camera front and rear on the van so can show me turning up and leaving a few minutes later.

I'm still going to try and work somthing out with the one I've got as it's somthing I've always meant to find a solution for but never had one of my own to play with. The only issue at the moment is I've scoped it through the mounting holes on the back and got the combo but it's not opening.
I've also undone the 4 screws on inside through the holes but it's not moved the mechanism.
I'm going to have to sit and think about this one, maybe it's been mistreated and somthings been dislodged, I did get it from a local scrap yard after all.

[Visitor]

OK, its not faulty, I am lol.

I forgot to mirror what I was seeing on the scope, I've swapped the results round and it opened.

I've now stripped it down and put it back together thinking the way to open it is to press every button then tension the handle and feel for the binding ones for the right combo but it's not that easy as the buttons are separate to the parts under them.

I'm pretty sure there is a manipulation to these now I've seen the workings but I need some more time with it.

[10ringo10]

Good work keep us posted if you make any discoveries on this
ie bypass or that hinge pin

[Visitor]

Will do, im not going to look into the hinge pin as im pretty sure the force required will knock it off the wall. The one I have here has been peened over on one side so theroetically I think it should be doable over a vice or in a press however.
Bypassing the latch will not be possible as its moved by a pin rotating in a slot so it's not sprung and instead uses an actual mechanical movement.

I'm short on time as I'm moving house but I'll get some photos up.

[femurat]

Thank you for the update. When you have time to play with it again, we will still be here.

Cheers