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First direct entry safe manipulated!

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LockManipulator

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Location: Florida, US

Post Mon Apr 28, 2014 11:38 pm

First direct entry safe manipulated!

Bought a safe on craigslist for $65. It had a broken handle and they owner didn't know the combo. It looked like it faceplanted and so the dial was probably messed up too. It was. It didn't spin too smoothly but well enough for me to try to manipulate it. I used vice grips as the handle and taped a laser pointer to it to take measurements. I just put a toothpick on the ground where the laser dot was and kept it in one spot and just compared each measurement to it lol. I found what I thought was the first 2 numbers 28 and 3 and I was taking measurements at what I thought was the gate in the last wheel/drive cam at 83. I tried it and it opened :D But once opened, I took a look and all 3 numbers were false gates! Horrible tolerances on this safe if the bolts can retract on the wrong combo O.O

But now, I need to replace the dial and the handle and I have no clue where to get spares. I looked everywhere online... The spindle is bent on the dial and I can't get it back without messing up the dial (which I did a bit already :/ ). I've never even seen a direct entry lock for sale much less parts. Anyone got any dials or handles laying around that works for this safe?
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Altashot

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Post Mon Apr 28, 2014 11:54 pm

Re: First direct entry safe manipulated!

Well, congrats on opening it.
Yeah that is some sloppy tolerances, opening on false gates...
Anyhow, you got it because you knew what you were doing. Good for you.
That laser thing is great isn't it?

Sorry, I have no parts but I can make some...Up to you.

M.
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LockManipulator

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Post Tue Apr 29, 2014 12:02 am

Re: First direct entry safe manipulated!

Thanks! I feel as if it didn't test my skills enough, it only took about 15 min and felt far too easy :/ Oh well! Cool, I pm'd you :)
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Mikeh727

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Post Tue Apr 29, 2014 4:48 pm

Re: First direct entry safe manipulated!

Great work! My first manipulation was a direct entry...a different animal but still fun.

This statement confused me a bit:

Daggers wrote: But once opened, I took a look and all 3 numbers were false gates! Horrible tolerances on this safe if the bolts can retract on the wrong combo O.O


Did all of the wheels have false gates? I have limited experience with direct entry safes, but the ones that I am familiar with have false gates on only the drive cam (wheel 3) while the other wheels contain only a true gate. I can't really tell from the picture. Wheel 3 has what appears to be seven false gates and one true gate but I can't make out what's going on with the other two wheels.

Do they all have false gates? That would be good to know for future manipulations.

-Mike
I have an amazing grasp of the obvious. Beyond that, not so much.
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LockManipulator

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Post Tue Apr 29, 2014 5:01 pm

Re: First direct entry safe manipulated!

Yes, all of them have false gates. The drive cam/3rd wheel is significantly bigger than the rest too, so the bolt will hit only that wheel unless on a true or false gate, in which case it will hit one of the other two wheels.
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Mikeh727

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Post Tue Apr 29, 2014 5:18 pm

Re: First direct entry safe manipulated!

Daggers wrote:Yes, all of them have false gates. The drive cam/3rd wheel is significantly bigger than the rest too, so the bolt will hit only that wheel unless on a true or false gate, in which case it will hit one of the other two wheels.


Thanks Jared. That's good to know. So I'm wondering...was the gate on the third wheel wider than the false gates? It seems that way with Sentry safes which makes finding the third number a pretty quick process. Mapping the other two wheels would reveal the false gates, and once you figured out how they were spaced, it would seem that you would only have to brute force 64 combinations to open this thing. I dunno, I'm thinking out loud here to adjust my technique for a lock like this.

-Mike
I have an amazing grasp of the obvious. Beyond that, not so much.
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer

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Post Tue Apr 29, 2014 10:02 pm

Re: First direct entry safe manipulated!

Very nice Jared!

Great to see the laser working. I thought that was just brilliant when uturn first mentioned it.
I seen Altashot tried it as well with great success. Very cool. Simple yet BRILLIANT!

And some great questions from Mike. I'm not all too familiar with direct entry....
so I look forward to hearing the answers. I've only played with one really.

Quite surprising to hear the false gate were deep enough to allow an opening :???:
" Enjoy the journey AS MUCH as the destination."
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Altashot

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Post Wed Apr 30, 2014 1:45 am

Re: First direct entry safe manipulated!

I find it strange that it opened with the wrong numbers.
It almost seems that something is bent somewhere, I've seen that before, when people force the boltwork with the handle.
Then the handle breaks...like yours. When the fence is bent, they are really easy to open. Sometimes the sloppy fit of stamped out parts allows for some twisting and/or bowing of bolt carriages and this one with this complex rack and pinion retraction system, combined with perhaps a loose wheel pack, maybe there was enough slop to open on a false gate.

Either way, you got it opened, and this is what matters. Awesome!
Now all you have to do is fix it, the other fun part.

M.
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uturn

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Location: south west florida

Post Wed Apr 30, 2014 3:44 am

Re: First direct entry safe manipulated!

Nice work! I like that safe too. Did you use a rubber band on handle for.consistent readings or just by touch. How did the laser work for you? I finally picked one up but have been so busy. Good luck with restoring that safe . I am gonna start saving for a fixer upper my self.. looks like fun..
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LockManipulator

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Post Wed Apr 30, 2014 12:29 pm

Re: First direct entry safe manipulated!

I did it just by touch, no rubber band lol. Nothing was bent anywhere, the door can be opened with the bolts just slightly retracted. It took a little wiggling of the door and boom! It was open. They just didn't make the door fit properly I guess

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